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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Tue Mar 02, 2010 23:45

Thanks for the info Ben!
The only thing I'm wondering about is
These markings seem to have adopted a different colour scheme than the later one used for the invasion of Normandy.

as I thought the same colors were used also til end of war.
For example, Tunisia summer 1943 and Italian campaign from Salerno in September 1943 to the Alps in May 1945.
Or are there different color scheme for vehicle markings and for personal belongings?
Greetings
Sylvia
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Wed Mar 03, 2010 01:48

Sylvia,
It depends which source you read really. If you analyse the 82d Airborne photograph that's posted on the first page of this discussion, then the colours used and the number which corresponds to them seems to be as the 1944 document suggests. However, inspecting other colour images reveals that the colours are different. I will try and post a photograph of some other, earlier MTO markings to show this.
Regards,
Ben ;)
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Mar 20, 2010 12:04

Hello all,

As some of you were probably aware, on Wednesday I headed to London in order to visit the UK National Archives. Having already conducted some research using its online catalogue, Lois and I were quite excited to discover that the UK National Archives appeared to have a copy of the Force Loading Forecasts and the Priority Build-Up Tables. I arranged to have the records presented on my visit so that I can inspect them and copy whatever was pertinent to this subject.

The records were certainly useful. Those relating to US Forces were actually modern day prints from the microfilm file the records hold, but unfortunately every page except one relating to the landings on Omaha and Utah had the Unit Serial Number column blanked out. As a result, I was only able to gain a limited number of US codes. However, the second record I requested (Force Loading Forecast) actually featured around 25 pages of British POM markings (which, incidentally used the same system and the US forces, so the research is certainly important), and Unit Serial Numbers for those units landing at Gold, Sword and Juno. This includes some American units (mainly Hospitals).

Here are the records relating to the US Units that I have been able to extract from the records so far:

Taken from Weymouth Sector Marshalling Area Force Loading Forecast:
45205 - 42 MP Esc Gd Co
30118 - Det 1 Med Gen Lab
46848 - Det C H/HQ Det 181 Ord Bn
45457 - HQ/HQ Btry 118 AAA AW Gun Bn (M)
45458 - Btry A 118 AAA AW Gun Bn (M)
45459 - Btry B 118 AAA AW Gun Bn (M)
45460 - Btry C 118 AAA AW Gun Bn (M)
45461 - Btry D 118 AAA AW Gun Bn (M)
45462 - Med Det 118 AAA AW Gun Bn (M)
44099 - 526 Ord HM Trck Co (less Det)
44561 - HQ & HQ Co 2 Bn 66 Armd Regt
44482 - HQ & HQ Co 66 Armd Regt
44557 - HQ & HQ Co 17 Armd Engr Bn
44556 - HQ & HQ Btry 78 Armd FA Bn
44508 - HQ & HQ Co 3 Bn 66 Armd Regt
44592 - HQ & HQ Co 1 Bn 66 Armd Regt
45556 - Co A 48 Armd Med Bn
43915 - 142 Armd Sig Co
44458 - HQ & HQ Co 1 Bn 41 Armd Inf Regt

Taken from British Force Loading Forecast: (pertinent to US units only)
38847 - HQ XXX Corps
36007 - 86 Gen Hosp
31031 - 81 Gen Hosp
39146 - Det 6 Neuro Surgical Unit
23705 - 79 Med Regt

In the interest of completeness, I will also be making a record of all the British Unit Serial Numbers I managed to obtain as well using our online database, but I will be updating the database to accept information from both nations.

Thanks and kind regards,
Ben ;)
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:35

With the help of Lois, we have now been able to glean the following Unit Serial Numbers and their respective Units from the Build-Up Priority Table amendments. I have added them here out of completeness, and will also add same to our Database at the soonest convenience. Please note that those entries featuring question marks represent those which were either poorly typed in the original document, or were illegible:

52668 - Hq IX Engr Comd (Det Adv Hq)
47364 - 280 QM Hq Med Det
31886 - Det 555 QM Rhd Co
43077 - 426 AB QM Co
42165 - 321 Glider FA Bn
43134 - 907 Glider FA Bn
30905 - 457 Engr Maint Co, 2nd Plat
30859 - 487 Port Bn
47366 - 74 Ord Bn Med Det
44971 - 31 Cont Decon Co (-1st Plat)
45951 - 538 QM Bn Med Det
32128 - 3565 Ord MAM Co, Rec Plat
47001 - 967 QM Serv Co
45680 - 634 Clr Co, 2nd Plat
32460 - 440 Engr Dep Co, Det
31442 - 502 Port Bn Hq
30969 - Adv Sec 11 Port Hq & Hq Co
43814 - Det "Q", 165 Sig Photo Co
30905 - 457 Engr Maint Co, 3rd Plat
43131 - 401 Glider Infantry
42094 - 327 Glider Infantry
42143 - Hq & Hq & Serv Trp, 102 Cav Rcn Sq
44893 - Trp A, 102 Cav Rcn Sq
44990 - Trp E, 102 Cav Rcn Sq
42196 - Co F, 102 Cav Rcn Sq
30459 - 2nd Bn 358 Engr GS Rgt
30385 - 1st Bn, 358 Engr Gs Rgt
32616 - Det, 606 QM CR Co
43793 - Det Trp A, 38 Cav Recn Sq
43791 - Hq & Hq & Serv Trp, 38 Cav Rcn Sq
43794 - Trp B, 38th Cav Rcn Sq
43795 - Trp C, 38th Cav Rcn Sq
43949 - Trp E, 38th Cav Rcn Sq
43796 - Co F, 38th Cav Rcn Sq
43797 - Med Det, 38th Cav Rcn Sq
30969 - Det Adv Sec 11 Port Hq & Hq Co
?8?93 - Det A, 255 Sig Const Co
46531 - ? 2nd Det Hq Adv Sect Com Z ????
32369 - ? Det 524 QM Car Co
33480 - ? Det 3681 QM Trk Co
46531 - 2nd Det Hq Adv Sect Com Z
43150 - ? Hq & H & S, 146 Eng C Bn
43151 - Co H & S, 146 Engr C Bn ???
44411 - Det A, 113 Sig RI Co
46531 - ? 4th Det Hq Co Adv Sec and Det 3681 QM Trk Co
42652 - Hq Co, 115th Inf (Overstrength)
49523 - Rcon Gp, Fwd Ech, Comm Zone
30281 - 222 Port Co
31194 - 223 Port Co
30723 - 225 Port Co
33625 - 534 Port Co
33627 - 535 Port Co
3?342 - Det 66 Cml Base Dept Co (March Party)
31491 - 4057 QM Serv Co (March Party)
32448 - 4082 QM Serv Co (March Party)
30440 - 339 QM Dep Co Sup (March Party)
33609 - Hq & Hq Det, 516 Port Bn
33626 - 536 Port Co
33628 - 537 Port Co
31179 - 858 Ord HAM Co (March Party)
46531 - Det Hq Adv Sec Com Zone
32369 - ? Det 524 QM Car Co
30759 - 9 Field Hospital (March Party)
30352 - 254 Port Co
31210 - 255 Port Co
30489 - 256 Port Co
30735 - 257 Port Co
30135 - 162 Sig Photo Unit (Det P)
50701 - 926 Sig Bn, Co B (1 Pl)

Thanks,
Ben ;)
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Fri Mar 26, 2010 20:05

Additional POM markings courtesy of Lois via Annex 2 of FIRST U. S . ARMY CONSOLIDATED BUILD-UP PRIORITY TABLES:

43308 - Hq & Hq Co, 9th Inf, 2nd Div
43274 - Hq & Hq Co, 109th Inf, 28th Div
43301 - Hq & Hq Co, 1st Bn, 9th Inf
43267 - Hq & Hq Co, 1st Bn, 109th Inf
43220 - Med Det, 1st Bn, 9th Inf
44919 - Med Det, 109th Inf
43304 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn,9th Inf
43270 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 109th Inf
43306 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 9th Inf
43272 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 109th Inf
42787 - Hq & Hq Btry 15th FA Bn
43243 - Hq & Hq Btry 107th FA Bn
42966 - A Co, 2d Engr Bn
43234 - A Co, 103rd Engr Bn
42940 - A Co, 2d Med Bn
43221 - A Co, 103rd Med Bn
42979 - Det 2d Sig Co
43467 - Det 28th Sig Co
42723 - Det MP Plat, 2d Div
43460 - Det MP Plat, 28th Div
42720 - Det Hq 2d Div
43463 - Det Hq 28th Div
42804 - Hq & Hq Btry 38th FA Bn
43480 - Hq & Hq Btry 299 FA Bn
43547 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 38th Inf
43440 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 112th Inf
43545 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 38th Inf
43438 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 112th Inf
43550 - Hq & Hq Co, 38th Inf
43442 - Hq & Hq Co, 112th Inf
43544 - Hq & Hq Co 1st Bn 38th Inf
43436 - Hq & Hq Co, 1st Bn 112th Inf
42979 - Det 2nd Sig Co
43467 - Det 28th Sig Co
42723 - Det MP Plat 2nd Div
43460 - Det MP Plat 28th Div
42969 - Co "C", 2nd Engr Bn
43236 - Co "C", 103rd Engr Bn
42942 - C Co, 2nd Med Bn
43231 - C Co, 103rd Med Bn
42979 - 2nd Sig Co
43467 - 28th Sig Co
42720 - Hq 2nd Div
43463 - Hq 28th Div
42721 - Hq Co 2nd Div
43461 - Hq Co 28th Div
42723 - MP Plat 2nd Div
43460 - MP Plat 28th Div
42783 - Hq 2nd Div Artillery
43465 - Hq 28th Div Artillery
42784 - Hq Btry 2nd Div Artillery
43464 - Hq Btry 28th Div Artillery
42814 - Hq & Hq Btry 12th FA Bn
43250 - Hq & Hq Btry, 108th FA Bn
42980 - 2nd Rcn Tp
43469 - 28th Rcn Tp
42965 - Hq & Hq & Serv Co, 2nd Engr Bn
43237 - Hq & Hq & Serv Co, 103rd Engr Bn
42966 - A Co, 2nd Engr Bn
43234 - A Co, 103rd Engr Bn
42939 - Hq & Hq Det, 2nd Med Bn
43330 - Hq & Hq Det, 103rd Med Bn
42724 - Hq Spec Tps, 2nd Div.
43462 - Hq Spec Tps, 28th Div.
43308 - Hq & Hq Co, 9th Inf.
43275 - Hq & Hq Co, 109th Inf.
43301 - Hq & Hq Co, 1st Bn, 9th Inf
43267 - Hq & Hq Co, 1st Bn, 109th Inf
43303 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 9th Inf.
43269 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 109th Inf.
43305 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 9th Inf.
43271 - Hq & Hq Btry, 3rd Bn, 109th Inf.
43243 - Hq & Hq Btry, 15th FA Bn
42787 - Hq & Hq Btry, 107th FA Bn
42804 - Hq & Hq Btry, 38th FA Bn
43482 - Hq & Hq Btry, 229th FA Bn
42978 - 702 Ord Co
43482 - 728 Ord Co
42860 - 2nd QM Co
43466 - 28 QM Co
43546 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 38th Inf
43438 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 112th Inf
43509 - Med Det, 2nd Bn, 38th Inf
43447 - Med Det, 2nd Bn, 112th Inf
43547 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 38th Inf
43440 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 112th Inf
42730 - Hq & Hq Co, 23rd Inf
43419 - Hq & Hq Co. 110th Inf
42732 - Hq & Hq Co, 1st Bn, 23rd Inf
43411 - Hq & Hq Co, 1st Bn, 110th Inf
42741 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 23rd Inf
43413 - Hq & Hq Co, 2nd Bn, 110th Inf.
42757 - Med Det, 2nd Bn, 23rd Inf
43446 - Med Det, 2nd Bn, 110th Inf
42747 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 23rd Inf
43417 - Hq & Hq Co, 3rd Bn, 110th Inf.
42979 - Det, 2nd Sig. Co
43467 - Det, 28th Sig. Co
42723 - Det MP Plat, 2nd Div.
43460 - Det MP Plat, 28th Div
42795 - Hq & Hq Btry, 37th FA Bn
43282 - Hq & Hq Btry, 109th FA Bn
42968 - B Co, 2nd Engr Bn
43235 - B Co, 103rd Engr Bn
42941 - B Co, 2nd Med Bn
43230 - B Co, 103rd Med Bn

Thanks,
Ben.
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sun Jun 20, 2010 19:34

Another one from my collection, although again a combination of a letter and 4 numbers...

Image

Duffelbag ID'd to Joseph W DEUBLER (ASN38698849), who enlisted from Lubbock, Texas
The code next to the color bar is H-0274

On the other side there's another name which suggests that the bag was re-issued to another GI.
That name is Edward C BEEHLER (ASN39472820) from Yakima, WA
I believe Beehler might have been a member of the 18th Cav Reconnaissance Squadron (14th CavReconGp of Poteau Ambush fame).
I do know he was taken POW near Cologne, Germany early 1945.

Image

No idea who was issued the bag first though....
'29th, Let's Go!'

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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sun Jun 20, 2010 22:10

Hi Johan,
Many thanks for sharing this piece from your collection. It's a shame that we do not know more about this alternative POM system (i.e. with the combination of alphabetical and numerical characters).
Kind regards,
Ben :)
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 13:15

Is a really nice work !
Anyone have the Overseas Movement Markings for the C. Co. 82nd Recon of the 2nd Armored or only 82nd Recon.... and the 41st Infantry Regiment of the 2nd Armored also please ?


Thanks
Filthy

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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 13:51

Following receipt of information relating to the 50th General Hospital, we have been able to add another Unit Serial Number to the research:

32658 - 50th General Hospital.

Thanks,
Ben
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 13:54

Filthy,

The only Unit Serial Number I have for the 41st Armored Infantry Regiment is for its 1st Battalion HQ & HQ Company. That is 44458. The colour bar should be (from top to bottom):

Grey
Red
Grey

I'm afraid I don't have the those for the 82d Recon...

Thanks,
Ben.
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 13:57

Ok thank you is alredy good :)


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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 14:24

Yes I know.... :wink: Thanks...
I have one friend of me have this one "an Litter, straight, aluminium, canvas" is possible to find the units ?
Image


Is same of 78th FA and A Co. 48th Medic.... So is really thats ?

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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 20:59

Hi Filthy,

I'm afraid that it's impossible to determine the Unit Serial Number simply from the coloured bars. The reason for this is that the colours actually only represent the final two digits on the 5-digit USN. However, as you've correctly identified, the colours on the Litter handle represent those of the 48th Armored Medical Battalion (as well as the 78th Armored Field Artillery Battalion). It is quite possible this Litter is indeed from the 48th Armored Medical Battalion.

Thanks,
Ben :)
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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 21:25

Hi thanks for your reply
any info for the 67th Armored I have two pics here but I can not decipher

Image

Look like 444?? here no ?
Image

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Re: [REF] Preparation for Overseas Movement Markings

Sat Aug 14, 2010 22:07

Hi filthy, do you have any more pictures from the same series as these 2 were taken on portland at the same time as this one thanks,matt
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